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Location: Fringe Season 2 Speculations
Discussion: Charlie Dead???
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tahitianflower |
Charlie Dead???
Sep 18 2009, 1:22 AM EDT
After watching the Season 2 premier we see Charlie, putting "Dead Charlie" in the fire furnace to be burned. I can't bare to watch this series without him! What is your prediction about Charlie? Is he dead or alive? In what world???( I LOVE FRINGE!) Do you find this valuable?
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Fringe season 2 speculations
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parallelk |
1. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 18 2009, 6:56 AM EDT
I think it was a mistake killing Charlie and I was disappointed. You can always get another Charlie though from the other universe. So I hope he'll still be on the show.
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tahitianflower |
2. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 18 2009, 3:06 PM EDT
Maybe they were showing the charlie from the other universe is dead. GOD PLEASE BE SO!
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brickonator |
3. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 18 2009, 3:11 PM EDT
While it was an excellent twist, I was seriously maddened/saddened to see Charlie supposedly die. Once person in another thread posted that it seems improable that the shape-shifter could kill Charlie, do the body-swap, swap their clothes and hde the body in the time given. So maybe there's more than meets the eye. At least we'll still get to see "Charlie" this season, and maybe we'll get to meet other-universe Charlie too. Do you find this valuable? |
LadyMurder |
4. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 19 2009, 12:03 AM EDT
okay I just couldn't believe within a few minutes he could change places shape shift..they could of done a lot better..come on fox were not noobs to sci fi..sigh I hope this isn't the beginning to the end for fringe .
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greenkiwi71 |
5. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 19 2009, 1:30 AM EDT
"After watching the Season 2 premier we see Charlie, putting "Dead Charlie" in the fire furnace to be burned. I can't bare to watch this series without him! What is your prediction about Charlie? Is he dead or alive? In what world???HUGE mistake killing Charlie. I mean, even if he is alive in another universe and we do get to see him this season, it doesn't mean he's a recurring character anymore... I understand that killing characters the viewers are attached to does have emotional shock value that gets the audience talking and sometimes even earns some sort of gutsy, artistic respect, but I don't understand what the writers were thinking. Charlie really provided a lot of soul and empathy to the show. Also, while those opposed to any Olivia/Peter romance say that Liv and Peter should have a brother/sister relationship, I thought Olivia def already had that with Charlie. In the premier you could really see what a profound friendship the two had. Additionally, the newbie agent jessup was such a stiff and vapid replacement in comparison. I'm usually all for girl-power, but there's a noticeable female-male imbalance now. Aside from her dialogue which was useful in recapping the main ideas (and I feel a little bad saying this), I feel like from what I've read, she's pretty much gonna be a temporary romantic interest for peter who might also stir some things up in the fringe division. Do you find this valuable? |
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BuzzardTJ |
6. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 19 2009, 2:24 AM EDT
| Post edited: Sep 19 2009, 2:35 AM EDT
I have an observation. When the shape shifter takes the form of the person with that little device, they leave the body behind. As we see in the first morgue scene, the dead body that triggers the alert that Peter and Jessop go to see is the same as the shape-shifter walking around in the scenes. Then, when the shape-shifter takes over the body of the nurse, he in turn leaves that body behind. (which should be by the ambulance dock.) My question is this: how come if this is how it should happen, the nurses body and that of the supposed real Charlie Frances are in the same room, wouldn't just Charlie's body be left behind since the nurse's should be back at the point where the shape-shifter kills her? I mean I also don't see a conceivable way, like brickonator had mentioned, that the shifter hides Charlie's body in the trashcan, goes and gets the nurse's real body (which by the way was not in the room when the real Charlie entered it.), and swaps with the dead Charlie. My main point being that the Nurse's body should not be there if the shape shifter actually killed and took Charlie's form. To me, its a very major continuity issue that I hope the writers purposely put there for plot significance or fix over the rest of the season.As an afterthought because I am re-watching the Episode now: In the later scene when Peter meets up with Broyles at the Capitol Building, he says the tech that is used for the shape shifting is broken. Does this mean it didnt swap the Soldier and Charlie? or maybe they weren't FULLY swapped? It does make me wonder though, why, in the coming attractions, it shows the shape-shifter-Charlie telling the mystical typewriter that [Dunham] fully trusts him and believes he is Charlie. Do you find this valuable? |
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calcanuck |
7. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 19 2009, 2:45 AM EDT
Just watched the Season opener and I too had the same issue with that scene -- one too many bodies left. And, even if the real nurses body was stashed in the room ahead of time it was clear the body on the floor had several bullet wounds when Peter entered the room. I'd say this is a pretty major flaw.
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BuzzardTJ |
8. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 19 2009, 2:51 AM EDT
I can't agree more! but it opens up a huge can of worms if it were purposely done. I'm still pondering my theory assuming it were done on purpose. However, it does seem to me that maybe only a half a minute elapsed between Charlie's first shots and when Peter and Jessop came running in. No time, even if the shifter didn't FULLY swap with Charlie, for there to be a struggle and for one Charlie to kill the other.I think it all just boils down to the fact that there are one too many bodies in that room at the time. Any other thoughts? Do you find this valuable? |
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brickonator |
9. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 19 2009, 5:12 AM EDT
I'm liking the idea that maybe he didn't fully take him over. Maybe Charlie is still in there and they have a mind-batter inside and Charlie regains himself.
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KayFlame |
10. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 19 2009, 10:47 AM EDT
i HIGHLY doubt that charlie is dead. not only does the time aloted between the gunshotts and peter and the new agent arriving not enough, but i just don't think the producers would do that.
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sabress07 |
11. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 19 2009, 10:55 AM EDT
this is the only slightly plausible way I think it could have played out (and its still a major stretch because of time restraints)...- shifter kills the nurse near the basement doors (leading outside) - later, Charlie passes these same doors upon entering the basement, which is right down the hall from the incinerator. in the same sequence, the laundry bin (where Charlie's body is later) can be seen next to the incinerator - the nurse's body could theoretically be hidden there. now here's where it gets tricky...supposing the shifter took only the nurse's identity and sweater (maybe stole another set of grubs)... - shifter surprises charlie, he fires two shots - Peter hears the first two shots and reacts; approx 3-5 seconds later two more shots are fired in the background --> during this time, shifter may have attacked charlie, pulled the nurse body from the bin and fired the second set of shots into it to imitate the wounds he (the shifter) had - Peter runs down random hallway A, we get a camera scene shift, and Peter is exiting another hallway almost running into Jessop(sp?) --> during this time, Peter's time is pretty much unaccounted for - we don't know how many hallways he had to run through, and we see Jessop enter the same doors Charlie passed earlier - meaning she had time to circle full round the building --> also during this time, the shifter may have put the sweater and badge back on the nurse, taken Charlie's uniform and put it over the stolen grubs, shifted again, and dumped Charlie's body in the bin in the background - enter Peter and Jessop (I'm gonna feel really bad if I've misspelled that like, ten times lol) So like I said, its a stretch, but is it possible? What do you all think? Do you find this valuable? |
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Quash |
12. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 19 2009, 1:13 PM EDT
I dont think so, I believe it all makes sense. It could have taken peter and jessop a while to walk/run to where charlie was at. Plenty of time for the shapeshifter to shapeshift into charlie, stuff charlie in a bin, and put charlies clothes on.Now then, this shapeshifter had to have overpowered charlie taken his gun and fired the two more shots we heard to kill charlie. I mean the shapeshifter jumped out of the 6th floor with no problems, with two gun shot wounds to the back. Clearly charlie here is waaaay outmatched During this time, Peter and Jessop had to have been looking for the room where they thought the shots have been fired. Who knows how much time MAY have elapsed. The Charlie we know has to be dead, otherwise why would he come back to dump real charlie into the fire. I think killing off charlie is a way for Peter to step up his role of protecting Olivia and being Olivia's parter now. And surely It will come to Shapeshifting Charlie against Peter who has some abilities we dont even know about yet Do you find this valuable? |
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p0ppy9 |
13. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 19 2009, 4:21 PM EDT
The gun shots just don't make sense. Jessop hit the shifter twice before it jumped, and Charlie fired 2 shots. So the shifter's corpse would have to have at least 3 bullet wounds for it to make sense.The real shifter only fired 2 shots that we heard. Not enough to make the real nurse's body look realistic. Do you find this valuable? |
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sabress07 |
14. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 19 2009, 5:57 PM EDT
"The gun shots just don't make sense. Jessop hit the shifter twice before it jumped, and Charlie fired 2 shots. So the shifter's corpse would have to have at least 3 bullet wounds for it to make sense.true, assuming Charlie hit the shifter at least once (it was practically point blank so he should have)... something else I just thought of, we're assuming the characters believe Charlie killed the shifter by shooting it. they (and we) already know that two bullets to center mass wasn't enough to even slow it down, and they weren't in the room when the four shots were fired, so for all they know, Charlie didn't get a single hit and could've just snapped its neck or something. we're never actually told how the 'shifter' died... Do you find this valuable? |
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tahitianflower |
15. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 20 2009, 12:26 AM EDT
"i HIGHLY doubt that charlie is dead. not only does the time aloted between the gunshotts and peter and the new agent arriving not enough, but i just don't think the producers would do that."I still think the charlie we saw dead isn't from the same universe, I think he's from the alternate one. (Hopeful thinking) Do you find this valuable? |
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tahitianflower |
16. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 20 2009, 12:37 AM EDT
"I still think the charlie we saw dead isn't from the same universe, I think he's from the alternate one. (Hopeful thinking)"Just something else to support my theory. In the alternate universe, Charlie would have died instead. He would of gotten shot. Do you find this valuable? |
Manimal77 |
17. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 21 2009, 1:58 AM EDT
I don't think he can be the Charlie from the alternate universe, because when Olivia is unintionally jumping between universes we see alternate Charlie with a large circular scar on his left cheek. So, if I am remembering correctly, the Charlie in the bin is seen from the left and has no such scar on his face.
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gil_cdn |
18. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 22 2009, 1:24 PM EDT
| Post edited: Sep 22 2009, 4:37 PM EDT
"After watching the Season 2 premier we see Charlie, putting "Dead Charlie" in the fire furnace to be burned. I can't bare to watch this series without him! What is your prediction about Charlie? Is he dead or alive? In what world???Here is a good answer to your questions ... from Anna Torv herself (directly) from an interview on Sunday (Sept 20th, 2009) after Emmy Awards .... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSuRROw_ztA Poor Olivia, she lost her lover John Scott in ep.1 of Season 1 and now she lost her best friend (confidant) in ep.1 of Season 2 ..... She also mentioned "who these shapeshifters are" .... and "what exactly they want" ..... so we can be sure there are more than one of them ..... Do you find this valuable? |
flikflik |
19. RE: Charlie Dead???
Sep 22 2009, 2:19 PM EDT
"Here is a good answer to your questions ... from Anna Torv herself (directly) from an interview on Sunday (Sept 20th, 2009) after Emmy Awards ....Great - thanks for posting - it's pretty much what i had figured (that Charlie was indeed dead) but it's good to have the backup. Can't wait for Thursday! Do you find this valuable? |
